Comments on: Prosecutors should never lose. https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947 fairly undermining public confidence in the administration of justice Sat, 02 Jun 2018 03:41:44 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.4.15 By: Sam I Am https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-5039 Sat, 02 Jun 2018 03:41:44 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-5039 I know this thread is old, however, as someone who was found not guilty of two Felonies, I had to chime in. In my case, Justice was served. However, not being tried would have been more just but I won’t be greedy about it.

My ex wife who had a terrible problem with being violent pushed the envelope every time that she acted out or “snapped”. My remedy was to always walk away, to never engage her, even after having taken a beating. I’m smart enough to know what happens to people in these circumstances that engage.

One night, she was drunk and became belligerent. I decided to walk away and go to bed. For some reason I decided it was best to just leave. I knew how it always ended for me. I thought I was being sneaky and left in my work truck. As I was driving away, she apparently tried to stop me in the dark, while moving, and drunk .183 bac.

I never had an opportunity to clearly see her and kept driving. I had no idea she was injured. She called and said I ran her over. After pleading with her for an ambulance, after I promptly returned, she declined and I drove her to the hospital. She accused me of running her over intentionally. Fast forward and I’m on trial for felony assault/dangerous weapon and great bodily harm less than murder.

Every one of my motions was denied. No evidence about her violence and a previous attack on my vehicle was aloud. There was a no contact order and a ppo. For many months I endured her harassment about “taking the plea deal or else”, various love accolades, so many forms of contact and I never replied. The prosecutor and others in the court did not care about the harassment.

She was caught lying during the trial, thanks to body cam that was made available only after I complained about proper miranda warning. She admitted to the police she beat me but lied and denied it under oath until the cam video was played.

I had more plea hearings than usual and even the judge tried to get the two of us to mediate the case! It’s the people vs the defendant not the victim vs the defendant. I declined every plea down to a misdemeanor. I could never take a plea to something I didn’t do.

Everything about this was stacked against me. I was terrified. A law abiding citizen having never been in trouble. But In the end, Justice was served. I still feel the tingle of ptsd from the whole experience.

You don’t even want to know about the divorce, the many law suits, and counter suits. The legal system is a mess in my opinion. Someone who was comparatively negligent should not be allowed to sue for their own drunken stupidity and be rewarded.

I don’t care much for judges and lawyers anymore.

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By: James https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-5028 Thu, 06 Oct 2016 04:23:39 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-5028 What do we have when, to secure a wrongful conviction, a senior assistant public defender helps and actually mentors a junior assistant states attorney?

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By: Prosecutors are not your friends. | People v. State https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1966 Fri, 26 Aug 2011 07:13:26 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1966 […] Prosecutors should never lose. Losing for a prosecutor is a disgrace, and prima facie evidence that he’s personally and morally responsible for the imprisonment of innocent people. […]

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By: Reasonable Doubts About Dominique Strauss-Kahn And His Prosecution | Popehat https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1959 Tue, 23 Aug 2011 05:05:45 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1959 […] they don’t personally believe in a defendant’s guilt beyond a reasonable doubt is oft debated, but I submit that there is nothing approaching a mainstream consensus in favor of such a standard […]

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By: Frank https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1713 Tue, 10 May 2011 13:47:44 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1713 suppose a prosecutor hears an accusaton from an 18 year old girl and never does any investigation whatsoever, does not take a wrotten statement form the na, 23 days later out of memory makes a report, and has the man arrested> he makes that man wait 3 1/2 years to go to trial and all the while recieves many many investigative reports from the defendants attorney stating the accuser was a liar and he not one time does sany type of follow up on those reports or the people who gave them, no investigation or even speak to people who were involved in the lives, home, neigborhood. he calls in the alledged victim 1 week beofre the rial to show her the reports and the proof she lied several times on her intitial report that was also used tyo have the man indicted and takes the man to trial all the while stating openly he cannot win, she he be held accountable????

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By: John Kindley https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1615 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 22:28:33 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1615 I can agree that a prosecutor who is justifiably convinced beyond a reasonable doubt of a defendant’s guilt should in general prosecute — although some imaginable scenarios involving very weak cases after important evidence is excluded remain problematic, since the prosecutor would essentially be giving the jury an opportunity to fail in its duty to acquit absent proof beyond a reasonable doubt and hoping it does so. The key words to me though are “justifiably” and “reasonable.” Prosecutors should be reality-based, and their personal and notion of what “beyond a reasonable doubt” requires should not be driven by a “close enough for government work” philosophy or the idea that their job to lock up as many people as they can. Rather, it seems to me that, because they’re public servants, their personal notion of what “beyond a reasonable doubt” requires should be closely correlated to their assessment of the likelihood of obtaining a conviction from a jury drawn from the public the prosecutor serves. Granted, some communities might be inclined to vote for a prosecutor who promises to try to lock up as many people as he can. For my part, I’d be more inclined to vote for the prosecutor who promises to try to resolve as many cases as he can by plea and who wins the vast majority of the trials he’s not able to plea bargain out.

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By: David Schwartz https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1614 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 21:19:17 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1614 Ah, so at root we have a factual dispute. You don’t think it’s at all common for a Prosecutor to be justifiably convinced that someone is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt but also believe that a jury is not much more than 50% likely to convict.

Perhaps we can at least agree that a reasonable Prosecutor in such a case should prosecute. And perhaps we can also agree that a reasonable Prosecutor will lose a fair percentage of such cases.

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By: John Kindley https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1613 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 12:05:44 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1613 In reply to David Schwartz.

And my counterpoint was that if based on the admissible evidence the prosecutor can only be 50% confident that a jury will convict then that evidence does not objectively constitute “proof beyond a reasonable doubt,” and the prosecutor should not prosecute. (If he’s more than 50% confident of his chances at trial, then he should probably prosecute but offer a plea that would make it unreasonable for the defendant to take his chances at trial.) The only scenario in which a rational prosecutor could be personally convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant is guilty and yet still only be 50% confident of winning at trial would be the scenario, addressed above, in which the prosecutor’s belief in the defendant’s guilt is based on evidence which will be inadmissible at trial.

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By: David Schwartz https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1612 Fri, 01 Apr 2011 02:01:43 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1612 In reply to John Kindley.

So, if he’s personally convinced beyond a reasonable doubt and believes the evidence is 50% likely to convince a unanimous jury, should he prosecute or not?

My hypothetical was never about someone who the evidence showed was 80% likely to be guilty. Of course you should never prosecute such a person. All of my hypotheticals were about people the Prosecutor was firmly personally convinced were guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

Again, this is my point: “I would argue that if a Prosecutor believes personally that the person is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and the Prosecutor believes he has a 50% chance of convincing a unanimous jury of this, he should prosecute. And if he does so, he will lose about half of these cases.”

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By: John Kindley https://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947&cpage=1#comment-1611 Thu, 31 Mar 2011 16:47:56 +0000 http://www.peoplevstate.com/?p=947#comment-1611 I’d estimate that if the objective evidence showed an 80% likelihood that the defendant is guilty, a prosecutor probably does have around a 50% chance of convincing 12 jurors to convict him, which you argue should be sufficient for the prosecutor to prosecute. But an 80% likelihood is not “beyond a reasonable doubt,” and a prosecutor who is satisfied by it is likely to convict a lot of innocent people in the course of losing a lot of trials. So I’m not suggesting that a prosecutor should have an “internal standard” for prosecution that is higher than “beyond a reasonable doubt,” but that he should personally be so convinced by the admissible evidence of the defendant’s guilt that he should be around 95% confident that a jury will convict based on that evidence. That is, he should rationally believe that only an irrational jury would fail to convict based on the evidence. It seems to me that being persuaded “beyond a reasonable doubt” requires nothing less.

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